Jeff,

one word 'Amazing!' :)
Great Job

Ries

Jeff: Who designed the stitch and Glue boat? Thanks for the pics. Joe

Hi Joe,

I can't say yet, because the business stuff still hasn't been completely worked out.

I'll let everyone know when the plan is in place. I will say that you'll probably see these models at the Seattle Boat Show at Lake Union, January 29th thru February 6th. :D

I am extremely impressed with his design, the pieces fit together perfectly.

Let me know where and when I can see them.

I am hoping to start on a Core Sound 20 (see here: http://www.bandbyachtdesigns.com/cs20.htm) once I get my MM running (early in the New Year?) so I will be very interested in sharing notes with you before cutting the sheets of (very expensive) marine ply. :D

In fact, that is why I started on the steel MM project, to build some wooden boats!

Joe on Whidbey

One of the plans I've looked carefully at is the Core Sound 17... a really nice design. My only gripe is I want something I can row as well as sail.

Have you looked at Welsford designs? I'm really partial to the Walkabout. (but the Pathfinder and Navigator are great as well)

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans...bout/index.htm

There are so many excellent designs out there, it's hard to choose.

The walkabout is a nice looking boat. One can row a CS-17 easily but the design is not optimized for that. BTW - have you seen the "wavy scarf" joint and, if so, have you figured out the "G" code to make them? (See: http://seaside5592.blogspot.com/2005...ped-scarf.html) Thanks Joe

I've done a fair amount of head scratching about how to do the wavy stepped scarf joint, thinking that it was a panacea. When I talked at length about scarf options with the designer of the models above, his conclusion is that on composite hulls of 1/2" thickness or less, tapered scarfs are a waste of effort at best, or at worst, the transition point on either end of the scarf becomes a new weak point. All that glue perpendicular to the panel also makes a "hard spot" which doesn't flex as fairly as the rest of the panel.

Once you sheath the hull in cloth, the benefits of a very large glue joint kind of go away.

He's pretty down on hull scarfs. He saves scarfing for timbers and rails.

On the fullsize kit, the hull panels will be joined puzzle-piece style similar to the PT skiff http://www.ptwatercraft.com/ptwatercraft/PT_SKIFF.html

Here's the finished canoe.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...k_jeff/023.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...k_jeff/056.jpg
This guy (my eldest son) weighs about 190#.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...k_jeff/035.jpg
The canoe was built primarily with my 11 year old in mind. It works great for him.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...k_jeff/042.jpg
The camera adds 20 pounds that the canoe could ill-afford. ;)

I recommend this design for anyone who weighs less than 150#.

I hope to have some photos of the big boat soon, it's going together perfectly, but here's a sample.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...jeff/013-1.jpg

those are beautiful pics jeff

Beautiful work Jeff! Amazing to see what you have done and kept things very practical for what you do. Impressive to say the least! keep up the great work and thanks for sharing your passion with us. Seeing your photo's helps motivate those of us who are building dive back into the garage/shop and keep at it until it's built.

Thanks again,
Travis

I just installed timing belt speed reducers (4:1) using the belts and pulleys from This post. Be aware that the small pulley is equipped with shields, and with the belt shown, the center distance *just barely* allows the two pulleys to fit... I turned the small pulley down 0.10" on the shield od.

I used Keling KL34H280_45_4A steppers.

I haven't checked the upper performance boundary yet, but I'm easily getting 500 ipm, and the only perceptible backlash is a function of belt tension. :D

All told, it cost about $400.

BTW, I'm still building boats. Life is good.

Good to see you Jeff. Interesting boat - what are the aft-facing "horns" up fwd?

Knee braces to brace a standing fisherman according to the webpage.

Hi Jeff,

Why did you changed from your geared motors? was it only because of the backlash? Did the motors give you other problems?

Regards,
F.

Nice to see you as well, I hope your new endeavors are succeeding.

In the northwest US, boats built for the purpose of "drifting" (e.g. navigating rapids) evolved to fish technically challenging rivers.

Here's a good example of the type: Driftboat kits.

I think I'm going to revisit the forward deck area design. Close, but not quite what I want - the knee braces will probably be a bit low for the 6' 2" buyer.

Two issues: first was the backlash, which was only a problem for our puzzle splices and when cutting aluminum. They were otherwise fine for sign work and the like.

The second was my attempt to use 1/2" pinions on a 12mm motor shaft. Suboptimal.

The new drives are much faster, which is good, but I don't expect it'll make a huge difference in how long it takes to do a project, since I'm speed limited by what my router can cut and what a router bit will tolerate.

It's a slow process of optimization. I think I've eliminated 95% of the suck now. :D

Everyone loves pictures.
 

http://www.westsatsop.com/

Launching day.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...s/IMGP2770.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...s/IMGP2780.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...s/IMGP2795.jpg

That is one fantastic looking PNW vessel! Nice high sides, plenty of power.....ahh

A real practical functional boat - nice job!

Humsafar! - nice - very nice! - thats URDU word, when I build my hovercraft - this is what I will name it to - hope the wife is ok with having a machine with that name. LOL

I can't take credit for the beautiful finish work. Humsafar (= "Travelling companion", right Javiera?) was finished by Sam Devlin in his shop.

It's a great design and is a very practical PNW boat. Not shown in the photos is the stainless crab-pot puller. It's an awesomely proper little workboat for which Sam is now offering kits.

Next is something completely different. We're in the process of cutting panels for a 48' power yacht. Seriously.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y58...f/IMGP2738.jpg

200 sheets of ply. :eek:

I do plan on building a boat, just not that size! Its nice to see someone using their machine to its full potential. Thanks for posting the pictures

Tim

Jeff: Nice to see the output. Thanks for sharing.

Joe #53 on Whidbey

Public Service Announcement:

One of the purposes of this build was to test the lower cheapskate boundary.

What didn't work:
1) my geared steppers had .010 - .015 backlash. Too much for my application. I don't recommend them.
2) inexpensive routers.

The cheap solutions that did work:
1) EMC
2) an old, cheap computer
3) rewound MW transformer for a power supply
4) chinese stepper controllers (I'm sure that Geckos are better, but these do work)
5) MW oven for a control enclosure. I consider it a statement of principle. :D
6) PEX pipe for cable management. It treats the cables gently with very large radii bends. I don't think I'm going to upgrade to cable chains on this machine.
7) inexpensive wire. My cable is 26ga (IIRC) and has a foil shield.
8) bootstrapping. The first router clamp was a hose clamp affair. V2 was made of MDF. V3 was a marine plywood setup with an improved dust collection foot. V4 was aluminum. V5 is scrapyard aluminum holding a porter-cable 75182 router. (which was worth every penny).
9) Lumberyard table. Steel is better but this works okay.
10) No vacuum hold down. Screws work great. The first toolpath is an array of marks to locate holddown screws. It adds maybe 90 seconds to each cycle.
11) Sheetcam. It's perfect for what I do.

hi jeff can you put more pictures of your machine? so will be easy to see your recomendations.
tnks

The overall appearance hasn't changed much since this post. Is there anything specifically that you'd like to see?

photos of your "cheap solutions"
Pex pipe
transformer
wires
i get many of the ideas but there is people trying to reduce cost since some part are expensive but easly replasable with cheap ones.
since iam in this forum with this proyect i became aware that the MM is oversised on some parts .. in the good way. this machine will last almost for ever.
thnks jeff

Hi Jeff,

Could u pls share the chinese stepper controllers details with us. I'm thinking in the same direction?

Tks, John

The controllers were these
http://www.driver-motor.com/ProductContent.aspx?ID=59

the documentation was poor but I eventually figured it out and they've been working reliably for nearly two years.

After using a 5x10 prt shopbot, I'm considering building another machine, but it will use more pro-grade stuff (read: Geckos)

Fernando,
The main feature of MechMate (imho) is "oversized". I recently had the need to use a shopbot, and although the spindle was nice, I found the structural rigidity was lacking and the software controller idiosyncratic.

Don't change anything about the car, z-axis or gantry.

torsion boxes
 

If I may drag you back to 2009 when you said immensely rigid torsion boxes, it implies they are hollow. Are they some sort of glue lam or four sides glued to gather? And while the Q's are flying the 4 X 6 beams, solid peaces or glued up,
are they stable in torsion and twist

MAC

Mac: The sides and ends are comprised of a 2x3 framework onto both sides of which is glued a continuous cementboard panel (Hardi-panel here in the US).

The solid air dried hemlock beams have proven to be stable enough, although kiln dried lumberyard beams would probably be less suitable than a glu-lam. In order of preference:
steel--> glu-lam beam--> air dried timber--> kiln dried timber

The air drying was important because the beams were acclimated to my shop for a year or two prior to use. The dual pieces of angle iron (the rail is bolted to a 3x3x1/4 angle which is in turn lag bolted to the beam) effectively lock in the warp present when it was initially built, and twist hasn't been apparent - although when you surface the spoilboard the net effect of any deflection is small - the material being cut will flex to conform.

Jef thanks for the info. I do like your approach I'm going to look up Hardi-panel.

Your Boat is coming along very nicely!!!
I have a long time friend, we have spent the last four years refitting his 46' Morgan ketch.
I have been on and off the last two with medical. At any rate we are destine to leave about the 15th of July. I for about 2 - 3 months him and his family are planing for 18 mounts. Through the Grate Lakes and south to the Caribbean

It is a good thing this has a spell cker or I would be totally incontinent, even then I spell the wrong word right.

It is good to see work done on wooden boats. I in days past raced an old wood Lighting
here in Minnesota.


MAC

I wish it was my boat. I'm simply contracted to cut out all the panels for the boatbuilder.

... but it's still a good gig. We provide good value. His parts are all dead accurate, he doesn't have to dedicate all the shop space to lofting and cutting, he doesn't have to scarf the panels, the parts are delivered just in time and his project generates far less scrap.

Jeff, how are you doing the scarfing, what is your setup?

There's a long thread on the topic here.

Our puzzle splices look a lot like the bottom example.

My first post here, just wanted to say great job to the builder, looks great and what I intend mine to be doing once its built. Sam Devlin is a great guy and very devoted to what he does, a true craftsman, I am flying over to brooklin maine to take his stitch and glue course June 10 I am really looking forward to it
I am a fellow NW guy, Washington

Has any one seen Sams new facility?

JT

Thanks JT, and welcome to the group!
Yes, Sam's new shop is really nice. He finally has room to build some of the spectacular projects he does. (That's his shop in the photo above).

Have a great time in Maine, and take photos!

Last I talked to Sam at the Seattle boat show he mentioned he had purchased a...ahem.....shopbot
Have you seen it and is it working for his purposes?
I am on the fence as to what I want to do, ie: purchase a pre-made router or build my own, I have a mill that I converted to cnc, and a lathe that I converted to cnc so I am fluent with the electronics and software, I am an engineer by trade read(glorified welder with an electrical license) so the fab work is definitely in my realm of expertise.
Which is why I am taking his stitch and glue course as it will force me to step out of my comfort zone ie: metalworking
I dont plan on building boats for a living but there are a few designs out there that I would like to build for myself (think small)
I have seen plenty of router designs and am active on the cnc zone forums
I really like the structure of the mechmate compared to other designs that I have seen, any advice?

JT