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  #151  
Old Tue 11 October 2016, 05:22
jhiggins7
Just call me: John #26
 
Hebron, Ohio
United States of America
Thanks for the visual update. Looking great! Looks like there's a serial number in your future.
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  #152  
Old Sat 15 October 2016, 13:48
Fox
Just call me: Fox
 
Amsterdam
Netherlands
Very thorough..getting close ! Good luck on the last bit !
Are you a brainsurgeon during the day ?
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  #153  
Old Fri 21 October 2016, 17:56
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Thanks Fox,
Definitely not a brain surgeon.
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  #154  
Old Thu 27 April 2017, 21:51
IamDave
Just call me: Davey
 
Ball Ground, GA
United States of America
That thing looks YUGE>>>What are you planning on building?
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  #155  
Old Sun 16 July 2017, 01:03
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Hello All,

I'm finally back at it..... although it will take a bit to wrap my head around this thing again.
I Moved and took the machine with. got it leveled in the garage.

I've been wanting to ask if I should weld the two Z's together for additional support?

Thanks guys.
here's a link to the latest pics.
https://goo.gl/photos/b2YK7z6tCxumeoKT8
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  #156  
Old Wed 19 July 2017, 20:17
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Hi Davey, I missed your post.
Was planning on cutting acrylic and aluminum sheet for custom computer case builds, but that kinda fell through... So anything that comes my way now.
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  #157  
Old Sat 07 October 2017, 07:02
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Hello all,
I haven't got too far since my last post, got both Z's mounted and the table bolted to the beams. plugged the control box back in and now both of the Z motors are too weak to move the axis's, they sound like the gears are jumping out of the teeth but aren't, just jumping steps.

any suggestions?
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  #158  
Old Sat 07 October 2017, 08:59
pblackburn
Just call me: Pete #98
 
South-Central Pennsylvania
United States of America
I'm trying to catch up here. Where are the motors moving the axes before and now they're not?
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  #159  
Old Sat 07 October 2017, 10:21
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Correct, maybe its been a year since but nothing has changed. Just disconnected control box and plugged back in the other day.
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  #160  
Old Sat 07 October 2017, 18:50
danilom
Just call me: Danilo #64
 
Novi Sad
Serbia
Check wiring, if one wire of four is loose you get the sound just like jumping gears.
most critical are the drives connection, inspect the connector for heat traces
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  #161  
Old Sun 08 October 2017, 01:27
lonestaral
Just call me: Al #114
 
Isarn
Thailand
Send a message via Skype™ to lonestaral
Yes, check your wiring.
Might have been a rodent.
A kitten chewed mine.
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  #162  
Old Sun 08 October 2017, 09:08
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Will do guys, Thanks. I havent been back at since last post, I'll let you know.
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  #163  
Old Mon 30 October 2017, 18:43
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Ok, I finally got around to checking all my wiring and connections and all had 0.0 resistance. I then swapped out my bigger X motor to one of the problem motors and same issue. I then swapped cables around and the problem stays on the same two gecko drives (Z & A ( two Z slides)). I then swapped out transistors, which made no difference.

could it be software?

here is a link to a video of the issue.
https://youtu.be/EmDsn9ra1Mc
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  #164  
Old Mon 30 October 2017, 20:46
pblackburn
Just call me: Pete #98
 
South-Central Pennsylvania
United States of America
are you sure your wiring is correct as far as phasing on the motors
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  #165  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 05:24
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
Have you checked your spring dampeners to make sure they are ok? Does the motor work ok off of the machine? Sounds like if this is on your Z axis only your lift cylinders may need replacing.
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  #166  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 14:53
bradm
Just call me: Brad #10
 
Somerville(MA)
United States of America
In the audio of that video, it sounds like the motors are actually spinning. I wouldn't expect to hear that accell - run - decell sound if the motor was unable to move. From that angle I can't see the motor shaft, but it sure seems like a loose pinion grub screw to me.
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  #167  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 15:21
pblackburn
Just call me: Pete #98
 
South-Central Pennsylvania
United States of America
From the video it appears you can move in one direction and not the other. Is that correct?

I have heard whining and grinding before at work when either the motion in the one direction has reached the end of travel or the weight is too great to move, you can hear that sound. If you are moving down ok but not up then I would ask, does it move up ok if you assist by helping lift when it is trying to run? Mike already made mention of the spring pressure. Also if the spring was installed with the rod up it has a greater possibility of the seal drying and relieving assist pressure needed for the lift if your gear reduction and stepper is not sized for a dead lift (which it should not be).

Any more info, even the smallest detail that may not seem relevant will usually provide the data to resolve a complex problem. I also recommend writing down everything you have done and the finding. This helps with forming a picture to pin down the problem or other issues that may need to be address.

Last but not least, with the motor not engaged in a gear or pulley. Will the motor turn both directions with no problems? If you are using a gear reduction method, attach the motor to the gear reduction but not to the Z slide and test the movement. Does it move in both directions? If these two tests pass then it is something in your Z slide.

I hope that helps.
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  #168  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 18:45
rischoof
Just call me: Rik #92
 
Goirle
Netherlands
Hello Bilal,
Can you put somewhere an acceleration parameter in your machine software?
When I started up my machine I played with this parameter. If your acceration parameter is to high, your motor can't handle and wil stoll. put it significant lower (each time 10x lower) and looks how it works.
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  #169  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 18:54
rischoof
Just call me: Rik #92
 
Goirle
Netherlands
for setting the acceleration parameter a had the following approch. I put it lower and lower, and when you start a movement from a certain axis you axis will move. when you have an very low acceleration parameter your acces will still move a couple of milimeter. the I raised the acceleration parameter a little. I repeted this until I reached a value when I stop the movement from an axis, the axis is visualy stopping. Your machine will run smoot.
when your acceration value is to High and you stop an movement from an axis, it looks like it's stopped by an hammer. and you will feel the frame shaking.
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  #170  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 19:04
rischoof
Just call me: Rik #92
 
Goirle
Netherlands
also check if you turn the motor by hand (when power is shut of) the axis is moving, it can be that your bearings are put too tight and the slide has to much resistance.
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  #171  
Old Tue 31 October 2017, 20:08
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
One thing folks should keep in mind, just like on cars, over time and with use these dampeners wear out.
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  #172  
Old Fri 10 November 2017, 08:26
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Hello all, thank you for all the replies.

Finally back at it again, I did check the motor phase wiring and its correct.
The dampers are still good.
Brad, at first the audio confuse me as well, I thought the same thing. But the motors still make the same noise whether they are moving or not, remember its digital signal, not just a blast of power. Signal accelerates and decelerates.
Pete, it was just easier on the motor going in that direction that's why it moved.
No gear reduction yet. The motors do rotate both ways when disengaged and I think I figured out what's going on with them.
They have been weakened for sitting for two years+, they became demagnetized.
The bigger pk299 are affected as well but not as much, they still move the X & Y fine. But I can actually stop both the pk296 & pk299 from spinning with one hand, glove on. I shouldnt be able to do that should I? Especially the pk299?

I did call OM and they said this is possible if they've been sitting for that long.

I also plugged in the pk299 into the Z axis (pk296) and it did seem weaker, but I'm assuming from the different transistor.

Accel parameters are not perfect but seem to be fine for testing purposes.

Another video of me holding motors.
https://youtu.be/d0hd5qaL9qs

Please let me,know what you guys think.
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  #173  
Old Fri 10 November 2017, 17:40
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
I may have missed it in the threads, but have you looked at your Geckos? Also check the resistance of the limit resistor on the Gecko. Also try switching Gecko's and then the PMDX 133's. If this issue is on two motors step back to the next point in line to test.
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  #174  
Old Sat 11 November 2017, 08:25
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Hi Mike,
Geckos are all green, I will swap motors again along with their correct resistors to see if it has the same power from one gecko to another. and check those resistors.
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  #175  
Old Sat 11 November 2017, 14:57
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Well, I made some assumptions at first.... regrettably.

I assumed that only the two Z axes were the problem because the other axes were fine, or seemed so.
All 5 steppers are weak, just not weak enough to skip steps on the X and Y axes. I can stop all 5 motors with one hand, each on their own gecko.
The gears should jump out of the pinion if it is a over weight issue, correct? it just doesn't seem right that I can hold the steppers from turning with one hand.

resistors on the pk299-4.5a are @ 240k(x & y), and the pk296-4.5a @ 82k (Z x2)
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  #176  
Old Sun 12 November 2017, 08:25
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
Do you have a degaussing coil?

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/genera...s-quickly.html

Post #9 was interesting about remagnetization.

But I have seen quite a few threads on demagnetization killing torque on these motors.

We may be on our way to a sticky thread in Motors Section.

Also may be time to consider switching to a cheaper type motor that matched the design of your electrics.

Import steppers have come down in price, so at this point I think one should order one to see if that is the fix considering all other elements seem to work fine.

Like capacitors, stuff does get "used up" over time. Of course in this case due to sitting.
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  #177  
Old Sun 12 November 2017, 11:30
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Interesting Mike much appreciated. I don't have a degaussing coil, but might be cheaper to try an import stepper first to be 100% on whats happening.

Also adding gear reduction might fix my problem as well, which is next on the list.

any particular brand of stepper you would recommend? KL34H280-45-8A? in place of a pk296-f4.5a

Last edited by Father-of-Ash; Sun 12 November 2017 at 11:54..
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  #178  
Old Sun 12 November 2017, 15:16
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
What voltage are you running at the motors?
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  #179  
Old Sun 12 November 2017, 20:01
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
Using the AN-10440, I have 57vdc out from the caps.
I still havent refamiliarized myself with the electrical requirements.
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  #180  
Old Wed 15 November 2017, 21:04
Father-of-Ash
Just call me: Bilal
 
Toledo, OH
United States of America
ok, just finished going over voltage requirements. looks like I'm a bit over the recommended 20%, should i be concerned? although it will match the KL34H280-45-8A @2.2mH inductance much better.

I ordered 2 of them tonight. will post what happens when i get them installed.
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