Mechmate Almost Home in Holland! #92 - Taipei Taiwan

[Gerald D]

Rik, you have done some amazing things to get great precision. Just remember that the rail is flexible and it will follow the shape of the beam when you screw it down. That you will fix with shims, and you can also fix other small defects with shims.

[shoot]

a great read rik thanks for sharing your progress ,look forward to seeing it finished

[rischoof]

I want to drill the 20 mm holes in the rials. but first I would like to see how those swichtches are mounted. and what is comming in the 20mm hole
Has somebody picutures if this?

Do I need to drill the 20 mm holes on both rail on both site? or is 1 rail on both side OK.

are the homing sensors also used as limit switches. I would like the situation that the power is from the motors before they hit the hard end stops

With kind regards,

Rik

[Gerald D]

The sensors will do "homing" and "limits"

Nothing goes in the hole. The sensor detects metal and the hole is suddenly NOT metal

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[rischoof]

I thougt there was going M1 18027 a 20 mm round piece of metal whith an excentric hole in the 20 mm hole. I was wondering how to clamp it
I think that I have to outsource the drilling of the 20mm hole.
The speed of the drilling machine I can use, can't go lower than 450 rev/min

on 10 20 000 gantry assembly I see M1 18 000, the prox switch holder 2 times,
on 10 30 000 y car assy, I see M1 18 000 1 time
on 10 40 000 z slide assembly I don't see a proximity switch.
on the part list from David Moore, is see 4 proximity swithces

Is there a proximity switch mounted on the z slide?

[Gerald D]

The M118027 eccentric is an option if people want to move the hole for adjustment. I don't think that anyone has actually used it. That eccentric can be glued in.

The standard drawings do not have a sensor on the z-slide. A couple of people have fitted sensors to the z-slides, using their own designs.

You can do the 20mm hole at that speed if you use a hole saw and lubricant. (even a standard drill will work if you increase the hole size by 4mm at a time, but it is not pretty.....)

[smreish]

For my holes I used a 5/16" pilot, then a 25mm step bit made for panel work. Worked quickly and clean - as you can see from the picture Gerald posted of my proximity installation.

[rischoof]

This evening I am "off" I turned off the electricity in the basement after the wall outlet became completely black and smoked.
Am glad, I didn't bought weld equipment and did the welding myself.

In my favorit street, there is a shop specialized in pipes. they had pipe in size 1 inch outside 2 inch. Nice material for the bearings. I bougt 14 pieces from 17 mm
for total 280 ntd. thats some more than 6 euro. Nachi bearings are 60 ntd each so I'am going to give it a try to make it myself. I red that it is not really necessary to harden the shoes. And my wife told me already several times I didn't use my lath much

So I was turning the "shoes" for the bearings. my emco is 220 volt and with a transformer connected to the 110 volt wall outlet. After I returned from a tea break, there was some smoke. I turned of the headswitch for the basment and tomorrow I will have a look to replace the wall outlet

last weeks I could spent much time on my project, and in the available time I did some resurch on the forum for the materials I still have to buy.
Last saturday I orderd the gears, racks, flexable cable gutter, and the pulleys for the and I decided to make a 1:3 belt gearbox for the motors.
The motors I am going to order at "tedmotors"in taiwan.

A dutch collegue showed my some very nice electronic shops were they have all the required electrical materials. And of course we had a lot of discusions about the mechmate. He just builded a smaller cnc router for circuit bords.

My x and and y cart are ready to take to the welder.

For the 20 mm holes in the x and y guide I used a hollow drill. I was easer to do than I expected

So this evening I could spent updating my tread instead of turning my "shoes"
I will make some pictures and upload them. 2010 will be a happy mechmate year

[rischoof]

picture from my transformer

[rischoof]

I just updated my story for an hour, but when I whould add the picture the program blocked. so I first added the picture and know do my story again.

Its a time ago when I updated the bulding progess. but In the meanwhile I made some nice progress.

I spent quite a lot time on making my V-groove bearings. Fist I made a serie with 2 single row bearings, I finished the shoe up to the V-groove and installed the bearings wiht my vessel (bankschroef) When I mounted the unit on a mandrell to make the V groove I mentioned that some bearings where not in line with eachother. When I had used 1 double row bearing, I didn't had that problem.
So I had to remove some bearings which I had installed with locktite 648. With a hand press and a custom made press-piece I was able to remove the bearins. I cleaned every thing and Installed the bearins again. This time wiht the hand press. I also made a new batch and installed double row bearings.
Than I had to make the V groove. I made a mandrell and installed the V-groove bearing without the v groove. I spent an evening grinding the right chisel and started to cut. but when my chisel was in the center of the V groove the chissel and the workpiece started to dither, Afther the dithering the mandrell was not in the center anymore (0.15mm) This happened 3 times.
After the third time I thougth: Time to outsource. So I went to my tool shop which has also a tool grinding service and asked if he could make the V groove for me. First he provided me 2 test pieces, I checked and aggreed.
I week later I had 2 sets of V groove bearings.

I went to my favorit street in taipei to find a welder. the welder I usely go to, didn't want to to the job. I think the x cart was to big for him. I went to the shop where I bought steel profiles before. We started at 10, unloaded the car, Explained in dutch whatI want to do. He can not understand english so then I speak dutch. The welding instructions with the PICTURES were very usefull. At 12 o"clock his wife has provide a meal and after the nap from his helper we started again an arround 3 the x and y cart and the spider were welded. At home a checed the parallelety of the plates were the v-groove bearings are mounted. Y car was within 0.01 mm!!! x car had 0.3 mm. I was very pleased.

Now I could mery the x and y cart on the frame. It was a very nice moment to see the y cart moving over the frame after a small push with my finger.

I installed the cable chain, but was not pleased. The chain was not flat. I disassembled the chain and did some fine tunig of the seperated parts on my table saw. I was a hard job to remove al the yellow plugs from the chain. The chain lays flat on the chainholder know.

In the meawille is Jeroen working on my interface board in the Netherlands. I want to use desk-cnc and jeroen is making an interface board for me. He has finished the layout and ordered some prints in.....china. So in a couple of weeks I expect the board.

I ordered the motors from ted motors. first they orderd the wrong ones. (they findout themselves) then the orderd 1 instead of 5. I first had to try the one if it is OK. There is something to say for this approach but I can not testing yet so I have one motor at this moment. bay the way, they brought the motor to my office,

Then I make a start with my electronics. I bougth proximity swiched. but I have to tell that I am searching them for the last 3 days, I put a bag with the proxis somewhere, but where.... I expect them to pop up sooner or later.

I also ordered my transformer. first I spent some evenings at the forum for the calculations and the experience of other people to connect the pk299 F4.5
I want to connect my motors 35 volt and then they need arround 6 amp each. I ordered the DST86EM83A from ted motors but they are (should be)equal to the pk299. price 2000 ntd
I didn't found ready made powersupplies here in taipei. but I found an area were are 4 shops in one street which are only selling transformers. I printed out the transformer I need and went to the shops. the third shop was YESSS. I ordered at tuesday, should be ready friday. finaly it was friday a week later but I have my transformer. Its over 6 kg and costs 2500ntd (55 euro) I also bougth 2 capacitors 22.000uF and some fuseholders so I can start making my transfomer an make a begin for the controlbox.

For the mechanicaly parts I still have to make 2 things, the gearboxes and the z axis. For the gearboxes I orderd 24 and 72 xl gears. But those gears are a little bigger than the ones I see in the gearboxes treat. I had draw a new layout in outcad for the gearbox but I am not completely pleased with it yet.

For the z axis I am going to use a linear guide and a ball screw. I have these parts and I have to make a motor mount for this unit.

In the meanwhile I started to remove the black layer from my metal parts and put some rust protecion on it. I hope thats what I bought. I should learns some chinese

Today I disassembled my frame and cleaned the glass-room where I builded up my toy. the children toys are also in this room. My sister, brother in law and 3 kids are comming next week so some kids have to sleep there.

I still have to upload the picture of my black wall outled but the pictures are at my other computer

[rischoof]

I could better do some spelling check before I uploaded. maybe my English teacher had right 25 years ago. jonge jonge je zult nooit engels leren. boy o boy you will never learn English...

[Gerald D]

A good story Rik

[Gerald D]

In Afrikaans that will be jong, jong, jy sal nooit engels leer nie.

Maar, jou engels is heeltemal voldoende en verstaanbaar.

[liaoh75]

Rik, you look like your well on your way. Please let us know how those motors worked out for you. When you get your Machine finished, would you mind if I come to see your setup? I'm particularly interested in your Z setup with linear guides and ball screw. I'm also curious as to your motors with belt drive compared to my OM PK296 7.2s.

[rischoof]

This is my black wall outlet. the connector from my transformer was cracked and caused some heat.

Thank you Gerard, for the comment on my english.

[rischoof]

Last saterday was a very importing day for the mechmate community in Taiwan. We had the first mechmate owner and all most owner meeting in Taiwan. I feeled like a kid just before his birthday.
So saturday morning I left at 4 o clock in the morning taipei to drive to the south. Way was quite easy, go to highway number 1. left the highway at the "firetruck"' there is a red truck on pillar placed near the highway. Drive to you see a windmill. Yes I am still in Taiwan and not in the Netherlands and then drive a couple of km and than I reached Davids paradise around 8 in the morning.

Normally we give some flowers, but in this case I had some useful parts in my car. I had heard from Davids huge vacuum blower so I thought he could use some heavy electrical stuff.
I had visited David, the only known mechmate owner in taiwan, and as a almost owner it is very nice to see a real full size blue beast and chat with the owner how he get his parts and how he has built his beast.
I was very surprised by the building quality and even more surprised when he showed his vacuum table. That pump he has is that powerful that it sucks through a 5 mm thick mdf layer. No No, there wasn't any small hole drilled in this plate.
When I saw the room where has placed his machine, whow that was big. my one has to come in the "maid"room from 3 x 3.5 meter or something like that.
Also the way he had made his dust collector was nice. just a room, I think twice the size my complete work area. So there is a pipe from his mechmate into this room, and just keep the door closed when you are working. I like this kind of solutions. and once a while you have to dig the room empty.
He shared his router bids secrets and gave me some good advices. I also think that I was able to give him some useful information.
I is a pretty that I didn't see the beast running over the table I didn't had much time that morning so at 10 o clock I had to leave.

I think I still have a smile on my face from last Saturday.
David thanks for showing your machine.

[sailfl]

When more than one Mechmate person gets together there are suppose to be photos. You want to see photos of these gatherings.

[rischoof]

hmmm, I think we didn't make photo's
I will upload some pictures of the interface board for the desk cnc I am going to use. Thursday I will see Jeroen in the Netherlands. He has designed and made an interface board for me. I think your gone see a very big smile on face again.

[liaoh75]

Rik, I think I got the longer end of the stick in that meeting. Rik brought me some very nice breakers and magnetic contactors. I will have to say I was very happy to meet another Mechmate builder as well. Gerald, I think you started something that will be here for years to come. Rik is a very knowledgeable about a number of things that will benefit his build. I'm dying to see the DeskCNC board and controller and will definitely be visiting when you are finished! Thanks again for the parts, I'm sure I'll make good use of them. I'm sure there will be opportunities for photos in the future guys. I'll bring the camera next time

[rischoof]

Yesterday I visited my friend to see the desk cnc interface board he has designed and made for me. It is special designed for use on the mechmate.
I have "some" knowledge about electronics but I am not an expert in it. so I have to trust what other people say about it.
some explanation about the board.
The board can be connected to desc cnc.
I can connect my:
1)proximity switches
2)limit switches
3)emo's
4)relais for spindle, exhaust, vacuum
5) is generating a signal for frequency control
6) there can be a buzzer connected
7) my stepper driver transformer will slowly power up

He knows me longer and he knows my electic knowledge. For that reason he has build in a amazing amount of safty things and diagnostic.

There will be 16 leds which will show the status, and indicate posible errors
sow it will show sensor and cable errors
He has created a document from totaly 30 pages, how to build, test, and use this board.

[rischoof]

board2.jpg

[liaoh75]

Hi Rik,
Do you mean your friend made this custom board for you? It looks like a manufactured and mass produced item. You have some very good friends. Did he charge you for it or was it more a pet project? I can't wait to see your setup.

Hope to see you again soon. Are you still doing your DIY wood working classes down south?

David

[rischoof]

David,

He has made a small cnc routing machine. His one is running with servo motors and desk cnc. With the experince from his machine and the input from me for the mechmate, he has designed the board. he let made 15 of these boards. There are some colleges allready interested in the boards.
There were some small issues with the first board. (He had to cut away one pin from a component and he had to bend the soccets from a relay toget them fit in the holes. This is solved in relaise 2. He has placed an order for these boards.
For me he has placed all the components and tested the board. It is made "hufterproof" That means that if I should do something wrong, this is not resulting in damage from the board, me or the machine
The board is nice, but if you see the effort he placed in the documentation. that looks also very nice. If somebody is interested in the documents I can upload it
He is planning to sell the boards. (just the boards without the components)

When I am happy, with the result, I will place an annoucement on the market place from this forum.

At this moment I am in the Netherlands, but when I am back in Taiwan I want to finish my machine. After I have seen Davids machine, I want my one running. Then I can test the board in combination with desk cnc. I want to make wood dust instead of all the rusty metal dust.

When He was in Taipei last year, he showed me the electrical shops in Taipei and I showed him my favorith street, the checheng street in taipei. There has bought some mechanical components for his machine and somethimes I am shipping parts to the Netherlands for him, so we are helping eachother.
And, when we are visiting eachother, we don't bring flowers..only parts.

[rischoof]

It's a time ago that I updatet my building activities.
Yesterday, the postman was my best frend. He delivered the desk cnc software and controller board. I ordered 3 weeks ago. It takes a week to ship from us to taiwan. custums wanted 600 ntd for the shipment.
So I am getting closer and closer to the end.
At this moment I am still painting. the paint result makes me allmost crying.
Whit a brush, I get stripes, with a roller, I get a texture instead of a nice surface Then I bought a airless paint sprayer, thats even more texture than with the roller. The best result I get with the roller and then after it, verry verry quickly touch it with a brush. In the picture the result from the airless sprayer
[ATTACH]10413[/ATTACH
I also made some gearboxes. I spent some time reading the forem and there are some nice designs. But the existing designs where not suitable for the xl size gears i wanted to use. So I designed my own ones, bring the files to the lassercutter. asked somebody in the chingcheng street to make the axis and ordered the gears, belts, and screws in the street. I also bought the flanged bearings overthere. The lasercutter did a great job, he made the holes in the plates allmost directly usable for the bearings. they where a little bit tappered so the bearings where fitting from one side and from the other side I had to smooth a little bid with some sand paper.
I bought one meter aluminium tube profile and made the distance bushes. I still have to shorten the bolds in the distance bushes and PAINT it.
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I also have my geco drives nicely mounted on a piece of alluminium
P1040751.JPG
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So yesterday may desk cnc package arrived. I unpacked the box and I was surprised by the size of the board. The board will be used in combination with the interface board a colleage of me made for me. the desk cnc board can be mounted on the interface board and connected wiht tree connector cables which were deliverd with the desk cnc control board. so the wiring can starting
P1040753.JPG

[MetalHead]

That is a cool belt drive. Do you have the plans for it?

As far as the paint you have two things to look at.

1. Make sure their is NO oil on the steel (wipe it down with acetone or paint thinner on paper towel or rag) and put on a coat of metal oxide primer. (I guess that is really two things)

2. Put paint thinner in your paint. Test how thin you can get it so it does not run and use a low nap brush or one of those sponge rollers that is used for trim work... (Heck I guess that is two things also ). You can test this on a scrap piece of steel. The thiner paint will level better.

So those are the 2 (4) things I can think of that will help your paint issues.

[rischoof]

Hello mike,

I have drawing en dxf files of the plates. I also can make a drawing of the shaft.
I also have the information of the belt, pulleys and bushes.
Maybe you are also interested in the prices I payed here.
My idea is that I first verify that everything is fitting and than post the drawings
or for the ones who are really in a hurry they can have the drawings

the paint.
first I removed the black layer with a grinder from all the steel surface. I tried to find a sand blaster here, but i found only companies with small equipment.
then I put on a rust protective coat (2 layers) after this I sanded the surface smooth and apply the finish coat. The temperature is still hot here when I paint that's at least 32 degrees Celsius. I don't know if they gave me the correct thinner for the paint. The Taiwanese paint is different than what I am used in europe, and the names of the fluids the have here is also different, if there is an english name available. Most is in Chinese last attempt I made the paint really thin, but when I put on with a roller, I had to go immediately use the brush to finish that is within a couple of seconds, after that time it wasn't flushing any more.

I did the base frame that way,and this look acceptable.
I will try a spray can I can buy here. cost of a spray can from 400cc is 2 euro.

I till have to do the y cart. I am removing the black layer of the steel, but inside will be a hard job. So I will look if I can find a sandblaster somewhere in the area.

[Jan de Ruyter]

Use phosphoric acid, chemical sandblasting! Works like a charm and the paint sticks better.

[MetalHead]

One other thing. Was the surface of the steel smooth? I looked back at the photos and it appears the texture is comming through the steel. If the steel was really rusted and you used a grinder to remove the rust it may have left conturs in the steel that are causing the texture. Try using a super stiff wire brush. If you still have pits in the steel and want a smooth surface you will need a body filler and sand job.... Or you can run with that texture and just call it a hammer tone finish

[KenC]

The only trick I know for good glossy hand brush job is to use slow drying paint such as Enamel Alkyd paint... You will have enough time to sort out the brush marks... Fast drying paint is just to fast for my non-existence painting skill...

Other things to watch out are degreasing the surface, curing of the previous coats.

But if you expect automobile bodywork finishing quality, sanding between coats is necessary...

Since I was way too anxious to get mine cutting soonest; I accepted textured finishing

[Jason Marsha]

It looks like a hammered finish. Here in Barbados the hammered finish paint that comes in the rattle cans costs twice as much as the normal rattle can paint.
So you got your hammered finish at a reduced price.