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  #91  
Old Wed 15 July 2009, 19:16
MattyZee
Just call me: Matt
 
Adelaide
Australia
I think Leo's contribution is quite novel and a welcome contribution to the belt reduction concept. It makes a belt reduction drive feasible for those with only basic tools available to them (which is what i thought the concecpt of the MechMate was about?)
The bracket would be low cost if added to the initial order. If you mount the plates to a face plate on a lathe then you could bore the bearing holes to suit flanged bearings like these.
FlangedBearings.jpg
The total cost should still be less than geared motors and you would have better performance w.r.t. backlash.
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  #92  
Old Thu 16 July 2009, 20:16
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Building your own belt drive transmission

Hi, I have designed and built two sets of transmissions with 4:1 drives that are now being tested on two different mech mate machines with great results, they are quite actually very simple in design and I am thinking of offering them for sale as a kit, or a completed transmission, so depending on what your skill level is you will be able to use them, and I was wondering what the response to this would be here, if there would be enough of a demand to make this worth while, and keep the costs down so they are affordable, you could use a cheaper nema 34 motor on these transmissions and out perform the oriental motors with the gear reductions, and have less money in them,
let me know what you think.......
Thanks
//chopper
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  #93  
Old Fri 17 July 2009, 22:06
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
I will try to go a little deeper into these, they are made of steel, and utilize the original motor plates, I machined a bearing cup to fit into the hole in the original motor plates and welded them in, cut the holes into the new motor plate and slotted the holes for the motor to allow for belt tension adjustment, and also made a second bearing cup to fit into the new motor plate and welded them on, then machined a motor adjustment plate to fit between the motor and the new motor plate, this plate fits around the motors round extrusion on the front of the motors to allow the motor to fit flush to the new motor plate and allows for easy belt tension adjustment, the shafts are made from cold rolled steel, and have flats machined into them to accommodate the set screws in the 72 tooth pulley and the gear pinion.
then two plates were cut from band iron to hold the new motor plate to the old one at the proper distance so the pulleys would move freely with out binding or rubbing, and were welded in place, the clearances were checked and adjusted
as needed for proper fit of the pulleys....
these are made of steel so they could be welded to the original motor plates
and so they wouldn't wear out, also if a bearing locks up and galls a bearing cup, the cup can be replaced easily.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 15.jpg (56.3 KB, 2707 views)
File Type: jpg 11.jpg (55.9 KB, 2701 views)
File Type: jpg 12.jpg (55.6 KB, 2703 views)
File Type: jpg 13.jpg (57.3 KB, 2697 views)
File Type: jpg 14.jpg (51.2 KB, 2692 views)
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  #94  
Old Fri 17 July 2009, 22:16
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
more pictures..... let me know if there is any interest in these I am thinking of maybe a kit with the bearing cups, new motor plates and the shafts,and band iron plates
or completed transmissions with everything but the motors, these will out perform plastic and aluminum, you will be able to get better,smoother,quieter cuts, than with the oriental motors with the 7.2 gear reductions for less money
it is quite amazing when the the backlash is removed how much easier the machine will cut through your material. it is almost effortless.
//chopper
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 16.jpg (52.3 KB, 2705 views)
File Type: jpg 17.jpg (48.8 KB, 2700 views)
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  #95  
Old Sat 18 July 2009, 00:38
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Welded steel . . . . . now you have my interest!

I like it!
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  #96  
Old Sat 18 July 2009, 12:14
Doug_Ford
Just call me: Doug #3
 
Conway (Arkansas)
United States of America
Beautiful craftsmanship Chopper.
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  #97  
Old Sat 18 July 2009, 13:42
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Gerald,
if it isn't steel it isn't real! just and old expression from my metal fab days....
Doug thank you for the compliment,
I also wanted to ad that the parts came from stock drive here is their link http://sdp-si.com/
the 72 tooth pulley is part number A6A3-72NF03716 @ 31.97 each
the 18 tooth pulley is part number A6A3-18H3716 @ 10.98 each
the belt is a 200xl with Kevlar reinforcement part number A6B3-080037 @ 7.61 each
I bought the bearings locally, I think they were about 6.00 each ( I tried some cheap internet supplier but the bearings were crap)
the steel plates were scraps that I had laying around say 10.00-20.00 worth for all 4 transmissions I also went to my local steel supplier and acquired some cold rolled .5 inch steel round stock to make the shafts the rest is just time...
//chopper
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  #98  
Old Sat 18 July 2009, 22:55
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Chopper, what level of machining (what tools), did you need to do?
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  #99  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 06:55
MattyZee
Just call me: Matt
 
Adelaide
Australia
Pulley reduction drives

While a belt reduction is not a new idea i thought i'd share pics of my pulley reduction drives. I got a friend of a friend to machine them for me from 1/2" 6061. Its only a 2.4:1 drive.

Pulleys and pinion bored to size and shaft. Still have to put flats on the shafts.
Attachment 5376

Machined plate. The counterbore for the motor is slotted by 3mm total (+/- 1.5mm) for belt tensioning.
Attachment 5374

Machined second plate. These were made to fit snuggly in the motor bracket plates.
Attachment 5375

The mounting screws protrude by a little over 2mm in the pics but i didn't have the spring washers fitted yet.
Attachment 5369

Attachment 5370

A with the pinion (not fastened yet, just sitting there)
Attachment 5371

Yes, the belt does clear the spacers
Attachment 5372

Attachment 5373
Attached Images
File Type: jpg reduction1.JPG (25.6 KB, 2701 views)
File Type: jpg reduction2.JPG (24.7 KB, 2701 views)
File Type: jpg reduction3.JPG (28.7 KB, 2702 views)
File Type: jpg reduction4.JPG (26.4 KB, 2697 views)
File Type: jpg reduction5.JPG (27.7 KB, 2700 views)
File Type: jpg plate1.JPG (23.2 KB, 2701 views)
File Type: jpg plate2.JPG (25.2 KB, 2698 views)
File Type: jpg pulleyparts.JPG (23.1 KB, 2699 views)
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  #100  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 07:04
Jayson
Just call me: Jayson #18
 
Horsham
Australia
Well done Matt. Great pictures.
These should work well.

Jayson.
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  #101  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 07:58
jhiggins7
Just call me: John #26
 
Hebron, Ohio
United States of America
Great work Matt. Very professional. Thanks very much for sharing such detailed pictures. We are standing by to see how they work for you.
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  #102  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 09:23
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Gerald,
I used a late to turn the bearing cups,
an iron worker to cut the plate and punch the slots
and a welder, on the shafts I used a mill to cut the flats.
//chopper
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  #103  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 09:38
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
here is a picture of a sign cut on my friends mechmate using the above transmissions, no sanding this is straight out of the machine, I don't know if you can see the detail in the v carved letters and the 3-d carving around the center of the Maltese cross where the ladder, helmet etc. are,.
the absence of cut marks and machine marks is obvious.
//chopper
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File Type: jpg sign.jpg (50.8 KB, 3209 views)
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  #104  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 09:49
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Chopper, I have converted all your pics to .jpg's and removed the facility to load .bmp files. They were unreadable to some of our users. Also, a .bmp file takes up a lot of memory space - the pics are now a third of the memory size without any obvious loss in quality.
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  #105  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 10:57
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Gerald,
thanks for converting the pics, I don't know much about that stuff
//chopper
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  #106  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 11:19
javeria
Just call me: Irfan #33
 
Bangalore
India
Lovely matt - that Alu will sure help a lot to dissipate the heat from the motors, tellin from experience!
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  #107  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 16:19
jhiggins7
Just call me: John #26
 
Hebron, Ohio
United States of America
Hey Chopper. Lots of great work! Thanks for sharing.

Just a tip about pictures...now that you'll be using .jpg, you'll find that you don't have to resize your pictures down so much. .jpg seems to be MUCH more efficient than .bmp, so you can resize to say, 650 X SOMETHING and the picture will still fit within the guidelines. On the Forum the pictures will be a lot bigger and easier for us to see what you're showing us. In IRFANVIEW, when you select SAVE AS, you'll need to select the format .jpg rather than default to .bmp. Just a thought.
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  #108  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 19:10
domino11
Just call me: Heath
 
Cornwall, Ontario
Canada
Chopper,
Those transmissions look top notch. Does your friend have a build log here? If not get him to post some pictures with blue and logo and get himself a serial number!
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  #109  
Old Sun 19 July 2009, 19:59
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Heath,
no, he doesn't have a build here and neither do I on mine, I guess I didn't see the need since my machine is similar to Sean's #5 and that it isn't Blue
but I don't mind sharing the changes I made I think that is where my machine differs slightly from others, just like the transmissions, I had an Idea to do something like JR"s transmissions but I wanted to have a higher ratio than he used and I also decide to use steel, I believe for many reasons that using steel is better, and it allowed me to fit a higher ratio into the same space of JR's aluminum units for one, thanks for the comments, for those of you who PMed me and for those who want to know I will be determining a cost for both the completed units and for the kit, and maybe an assembled unit with out the pulleys and belts,
thanks for the feed back keep it coming...
//chopper
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  #110  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 08:15
domino11
Just call me: Heath
 
Cornwall, Ontario
Canada
Chopper,
There have been other guys on the forum with non blue, and they still got a serial number! Yellow, Black, White and Red have all been used for one reason or another. Lets see some pics if you have the time.
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  #111  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 18:16
smreish
Just call me: Sean - #5, 28, 58 and others
 
Orlando, Florida
United States of America
Chop,
Thanks for the shout-out!
Ah, just post a pic or two, that's what keeps us all in this together...pictures.
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  #112  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 20:37
PEU
Just call me: Pablo
 
Buenos Aires
Argentina
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopper View Post
you will be able to get better,smoother,quieter cuts, than with the oriental motors with the 7.2 gear reductions for less money
//chopper
Cheaper I understand since OM are $250 apiece, but why better?
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  #113  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 20:51
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Pablo,
the difference between the 7.2's and the belt drive is the backlash in the geared drives on the 7.2's there is about 5 thousands back lash,
I know this is not much and will probably depend on what you are cutting to see the difference, with the belts the back lash is eliminated making the cuts smoother, less power is need to make the cuts, since your router/spindle doesn't have to work as hard to do the same work, it is kinda hard to explain but one you see it in action you will understand, I wouldn't have believed it my self if I didn't see it, I made a set of these for a friend of mine and he said the same thing, that He wouldn't have believed it unless He seen it for Him self,
it is quite really amazing difference, since I installed the belt drives I leave my router set at 8k and never move it it cuts sooooo much better...I hope that helped //chopper
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  #114  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 20:54
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
here are some more pics of the belt drives, I think these will be better tha the other ones//chopper
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (42.5 KB, 3121 views)
File Type: jpg 2.jpg (42.3 KB, 3247 views)
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  #115  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 21:04
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
one more
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File Type: jpg 3.jpg (42.6 KB, 3121 views)
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  #116  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 21:20
MattyZee
Just call me: Matt
 
Adelaide
Australia
They look great! I like the adjuster screw for the motor tensioning. Very handy.
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  #117  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 21:24
MattyZee
Just call me: Matt
 
Adelaide
Australia
I'm guessing your shaft is a straight shaft with no steps or shoulders on it? (So you can remove the shaft to install/replace the belt). Do you have any teflon shims/washers either side of the large pulley?
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  #118  
Old Mon 20 July 2009, 21:45
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Matt,
yes the shafts are straight held in by the set screws on the pulley,
and no there are no washers or spacers between the pulley an the bearing
there is about 10 thousands gap between the pulley and the bearing,
I haven't experienced any rubbing from this, but if you desired you could you could put them in there, but since it is up against the bearing center that spins with the shaft there is no issue//chopper
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  #119  
Old Tue 21 July 2009, 01:15
javeria
Just call me: Irfan #33
 
Bangalore
India
how many teeth of of smaller pulley mesh with the belt??
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  #120  
Old Tue 21 July 2009, 10:46
chopper
Just call me: chopper
 
Big Lake Minnesota
United States of America
Ifran,
if you look at post 19, you can see that the belt contacts about 1/3 of the pulley, it has 18 teeth, with would put it at about 6-7 teeth
//chopper
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