Finishing the floors in my shop. Which way to go?!?!

[cvriv.charles]

You guys are good! I love it! You guys are reading my thoughts!!! Scary. I was bouncing back and forth between sheetrock and OSB(aspenite). I dont know if it was you or another member but I saw pics of someone shop on this forum with OSB walls. That intrigued me.

Its a bit more expensive than sheet but would last longer. Now that you mentioned it I think I will go that way. I was also thinking that I would screw stuff right to it to hang stuff.

Thanks dude

[domino11]

Its actually cheaper per sheet here. $7 for osb and $12 for sheetrock. I have done three garages so far with it and will not use anything else. A tip for the cracks, us some latex caulking to fill in any little cracks and corners etc. Then prime and paint.

[cvriv.charles]

I am thinking about tearing those stairs I built down. Reason being that I am very sure I want to make the small room my MM room. Reason being that everything will be contained within that room. Noise, any dust, etc. The room is 9ft wide and like 20 something feet long. But the stairs would be kind of close to the MM. Im thinking about installing an attic stairs again. This way I can close it getting it completely out of the way. Plus I wont have to hear it from the inspector about the stairs not being to code.

I have the electrical coming out today. I will talk to him about wiring some 240V outlets along with a few 120's in that small room.

OH,... and the ceiling is only 96" the dust collector I was looking at is a 4 bag, 4Hp, collector. its 101 in height. if I do not OSB the ceiling I can fit that between the ceiling beams. But I do want to OSB atleast the ceiling in that room. I want to keep that room cold for the MM. I was thinking about keeping the dust collector in the bigger room on teh other side of the wal and running the hose through the wall.

[cvriv.charles]

Originally Posted by domino11

Its actually cheaper per sheet here. $7 for osb and $12 for sheetrock. I have done three garages so far with it and will not use anything else. A tip for the cracks, us some latex caulking to fill in any little cracks and corners etc. Then prime and paint.

Not by me. 6 for 3/8 sheetrock and 9 for 7/16 osb. I will use latex caulk for fine cracks.

[cvriv.charles]

Sweet I found a concete grinder for rent by my house! Im going to fill in the drain with concrete. Once hardened I will then rough grind the whole floor down so its smooth and flat. I might be able to grind enough away so I dont have to patch the large chipped areas. Just grind them away. I might be able to grind away the area of the floor around the drain enough so thats its not sloping down towards the drain as much. Nice and flat. Awesome.

[Gerald D]

The concrete grinder's rental rate is per day and per millimeter of head wear. You normally spend more on the wear of the grinder blocks.

[cvriv.charles]

That i dont care about. If I can grind the floor down to the way I want it,... i'll pay it.

Problem is though,... been reading on some of the rental sites, their concrete grinders are wimpy. Only removes finishes. A very thin layer. I need something thats going to seriously eat the concrete. I'll have to keep looking.

[MetalHead]

This is what you need
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-0vY...eature=related

Or like this one I have
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTpxQ...eature=related

The trick is the grit stones. 80 will mill down the concrete very quickly.

If you can rent a setup like the first video that comes with a Vac that is the way to go. TONS of dust doing this work.

In this economy call some garage refitters in your area and they will probably hook you up for a goo price. SHould be in the $3.50 to $4.50 a square foot to surface and finish your floor. No more that $6 I would think a square foot.

Get bids. You may find it cheaper and faster to pay someone else to do the work.

Here is a good video explaining why to sub this out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAGFEmFIGe8&NR=1

[Gerald D]

We control the dust by wet grinding.

[KenC]

I'm really puzzle... from where I'm from, we grind granite, marble & other natural stone floor. BUT When it comes to concrete, we just hack the whole lot & re-pur the floor... then poweder float the surface if we wants smooth finishing...

2" concrete is way too thin in my part of the world, we actually pour as thick as 3" for our badminton court with grade 25 concrete. + 1 layer of A1 mesh.

For workshop, we go minimum 4" thk with grade 35 & 2 layers A2 mesh. 6" is very common. with at least 3" thk compact stone sub base, 4" bakau piles at 1yd c/c grid if neccessary.

[cvriv.charles]

Well,... there's one place that has exactly what I should get.

Electric dual disc grinder:
http://www.sunbeltrentals.com/equipm...040&catid=s340

The special vac:
http://www.sunbeltrentals.com/equipm...410&catid=s339

Its about 90 a day for EACH. And im assuming I have to buy the discs. How many discs I need,... I dont know. I could probably get it done in a day. My garage is about 700sqf.

Then theres another place where there site isnt specfic at all about the grinder they do have. It says gas/ electric. I emailed them and they said,

"We carry the grinders for your application. You would use an electric dual head grinder w/ abrasive stones. The grinder rents for $80/Day or for the weekend. The set of stones is approx. $39.00. If your garage is big, I can give you an extra set and whatever you don't use you can return. We close at 4:15 today."

Dont know if it comes with the vac though. But like Gerald said I can probably just wet the floor down good. I might give this a go next weekend.

[cvriv.charles]

I just noticed now that they attached pdf files to that email. Its 80 a day for an electric dual head Edco. Pretty much like the one in the second video you posted metalhead. Dont think it comes with the vac.

Do you think I should get that and just keep the floor wet for dust control? Im thinking yes. The other is very much the right tool for the job but we're talking 180 a day easily. What do you think?

[MetalHead]

You can use a shopvac on the unit if you have one. Wet grinding is a mess in a finished house. If you have Sheetrock on the walls you can't get those wet.

Wet works good for big open wharehouses. Not so easy to control in a house. You should be able to get the vac as well for a few dollars more. They can tell you what grit you need, but typical grinding uses 80 grit.

The electric units come in two flavors - 110 and 220 . The 220 model will typically will be able to be ran on your dryer plug without isses. You will need a 20amp or better circuit for the 110 to keep from blowing the breaker constantly.

Best time to rent these is over a holiday weekend and work out the deal with the supplier to let you pick it up late the day before you start.

Say you have a Friday, Saturday , Sunday holiday. Tell them you want to pickup the machine at just before COB on Thursday and you take it back at SOB (Start of business) on Monday.

This should still trigger a one day rental. If not just tell them you will go see someone else in your area who will rent to you like this.

Don't be suprised if it takes you a lot longer than you figured to get the floor like you want it.

Also keep in mind you will not be able to get the last 2 or 3 inched next to the wall. That has to be done with a hand grinder. They make a hand grinder stand to do this so you don't have to crawl around on the floor.

More reading for you.

http://www.edcoinc.com/floor-grinders-2ec.html

But I am no expert ...... Just did a lot of research when I was looking to get into the garage refit business.

I would call a few folks in your area and atleast get 3 bids just to see what folks are willing to do in this economy.

[MetalHead]

One more thing. If you are only wanting to "scale" the floor and "open" up the pours by peeling off a micro layer of concrete and and flaky concrete.

You can use a buffing machine with a 80grit sanding pad instead of a full blown grinder. They prep the floor for paint and epoxies very well.

http://www.floorbuffers.com/Qstore/p001908.htm

Ask about these types of machines.

[cvriv.charles]

Well im resurfacing the floor in my detached garage so water mess is fine. I know it will be sloppy,... I dont care. As long as I get he finish I want.

The guys at the one place said 80 for a weekend. Thats pretty good. Im sure i can squeeze some extra time in there.

I need to do more then just remove the top layer. I need to grind away some damaged spots and flatten out some areas.

Not all that worried about the 2 - 3 inches up against the walls that will be missed. I i can scrub that clean with a steel bush easily. Its mainly the inner floor that needs the work.

I think the electric they are offering is 110v. I have a good 20amp breaker for it. I also have a 220v outlet too.

Thanks for your help.

[servant74]

Sorry for the bleated reply ... sounds like you know what you want to do.

The floor I wanted in a shop ever since I was in college was end grain oak block floor.

Start with a concrete floor, put in 1 to 2 inches of sand, then 4x4 or whatever oak blocks about 6" long (today you can find them 1-2" long) and stack them vertically side by side with then end grain showing. Tamp it down and keep it level. Sweep in some sand to fill in the cracks. Sand it down if you need to with a floor type sander.

It was wonderful to stand and work on. Swept up easily. Absorbed sound, dropped tools didn't break easily, absorbed any drips of oil or liquids within reason, and non-conductive. It was looking good after over 50 years of use when I was there many moons ago (30+ years).

We rolled machine tool carts with steel wheels on it without problems. Large trucks didn't phase it. If a few got damaged, it was fairly easy to put a screw eye in a block, pull it out with a hoist, and install a new one. ... No glue, no nails, but it was indoors (not conditioned year round).

[Regnar]

I havent heard anything about putting flakes down in the paint and I highly recommend this. Reason being is that on rainy, snowy, misty days you will track in water. Smooth epoxy floor are very slippery. I have seen a truck slam into a helicopter with all 4 tires locked up.

I read that you want to get rid of slopes and drains. I woudnt infact I would make your drain bigger if it was me. You can find larger grate sizes that will allow you to stick a 3 or 5 gallon bucket down inside to catch anything that you dont want in the well but for those times that you want to clean the floor. Its just a matter of going in with a hose and squeegee. At work we have a drain that is 3 feet wide by 300 feet long that goes through the middle of the hanger. When we clean out a space we go in with a pressure washer and 5 guys with squeegees. Takes a little under 15 minutes to do 2,000sqft.

If your dust collector bags are what is hitting the ceiling then just get rid of them. In that nice open country of yours I would just install a cyclone and pipe what ever doesnt get caught out the side of the garage. Its usually really fine dust that the cyclone doesnt get and would keep the shop cleaner and not as much maintenance on the filters. Here is a good site for building your own cyclone.http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm

Another thing that came to mind is you could build a small shed off the side of garage and house the cyclone in there. I would also build it big enough to house a 60 - 80 gallon compressor. Keep all the noisey, dirty things outside

Some day I will have far away neighbors but for now their bedroom is 15 feet away from my garage/shop. I know I would hate to have me as a neighbor.

[swatkins]

I think I would go another route... Renting the machine is one thing, having the skill to produce a finished floor that looks really good is another.. Your going to have a steep learning curve, race against time with the machine rental and then have to clean up a big mess when your through...

I would fill in all the major cracks and drains if you really want them to go and then use use this stuff to level out the floor..

http://www.edisoncoatings.com/store/Level-X52.html

[Johannescnc]

I agree with Ken on this one and would just bust out the old and re-pour a new one...

[Allegheny]

Upgrading the house to 400Amps would be INCREDIBLY expensive. I looked into this ten years ago - just the breaker box and the 400A main breaker were $2k! You don't want to even think about the service entrance cable to carry 400A, let alone to carry 200A to the shop.

Much simpler is to have the electric co run a separate 200A service directly to the shop - it'll have it's own meter and a separate monthly bill. Even a SquareD panel and full set of breakers for it should be less than $6-700. That will actually be a good thing should you ever convert it over to a business.

Brian

[cvriv.charles]

WOW! Thats expensive to upgrade the house to 400a. 600 - 700 for a seperate service of 200a for the garage is very doable. I actually had talked my my electrician and he said if I split the 200a panel in the house so that I had 100a for the house and 100a for the garage that I would probably be just fine. But im assuming it would probably cost as much to have a seperate 200a service installed. I'll have to call and get quoted for the seperate service. 200a would hold me over for awhile.

I didnt get to doing the floors yet in the garage. Been stupid busy working on my basement. Im refinishing it. Im thinking my next weekend off I will do the floors. My girlfriend keeps bring stuff into the garage. furniture and all. Im going to move all that stuff out. Thats my space. She knows that.

[swatkins]

Check on the monthly cost for the two different services.. Our electricity provider charges 27.00 per month just for each meter. Thats 324.00 US per year for each meter alone... Electricity is extra... If you can get buy on one service that would save you some money in the long run...

[cvriv.charles]

Well the etra money spent per year I think will be well worth not having to stress over power issues. With a 200a service I could easily run 2 mm's plus whatever else that needs to be run. I will be making money with my machines so it won't be a big deal. Forking out the initial is what I'm worrying about right now...

With a single service split 100/ 100 I would just barely make it.

[domino11]

Charles,
I have a 200A service in my house at the moment and with it I feed my shop with a 100A breaker. Now when I am in the shop I can use 100A all day long, If you do not have 10 guys working in there, there is now way you will ever use 100A as far as I am concerned. Also you still have the full 200A available to the house (less whatever you are using in the garage). As long as the draw of house and garage is under 200A you are lots safe. I would put in a 200A panel in the garage so if later you really do need a service upgrade once business is booming, you can still use it with the new service feed at a later date, just disconnect from the house and get utility company to run a new feed.

[cvriv.charles]

Originally Posted by domino11

Charles,
I have a 200A service in my house at the moment and with it I feed my shop with a 100A breaker. Now when I am in the shop I can use 100A all day long, If you do not have 10 guys working in there, there is now way you will ever use 100A as far as I am concerned. Also you still have the full 200A available to the house (less whatever you are using in the garage). As long as the draw of house and garage is under 200A you are lots safe. I would put in a 200A panel in the garage so if later you really do need a service upgrade once business is booming, you can still use it with the new service feed at a later date, just disconnect from the house and get utility company to run a new feed.

Well,... I will get quotes. Because the wire I have is only good up to 50a. so I will need someone to pull that out and replace with a thicker wire. That will involve cutting up some concrete and trenching to the garage. IF that turns out to be the cheaper way I might go with that. But if not or its the same price as the completely new service the garage,... ill go with the new service because atleast that way its one thing I dont have to worry about later. Im going to have a lot of stuff running at one time. Atleast I want to prepare for a lot of stuff to be run at once. 2 MM router, 1 MM plasma cutter, dust collector, maybe a large compressor(if it should start running), and a TIG welder. I definitely see all all this running at once. Maybe minus the plasma cutter because I dont know how much cutting I will be doing with it but you never know. Very possible.