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-   -   Doing Some Inlay Work! #69 - Holiday FL USA (http://www.mechmate.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2522)

sailfl Fri 05 March 2010 05:24

Russell,

It is look very good. I think you will be ok with the size of you box.

MetalHead Fri 05 March 2010 05:32

What size is your box?

Regnar Fri 05 March 2010 09:30

Nils, It going to have to work. These things are not cheap plus shipping it back and forth for a new one is just not economical. I know you told me to go with a bigger box and I though I had but who know what happened :rolleyes:

Mike it is 20"H x 16"W x 8"D. If I had to do it again I would order something maybe 2 inches bigger all the way around. The depth seems fine for now but we will see. Its just going to be some creative/ neat wiring.

Gerald D Fri 05 March 2010 09:53

That power supply can be rebuilt into a smaller package.

sailfl Fri 05 March 2010 10:09

Russell,

It will be tight but it looks like you have room for every thing.

MetalHead Fri 05 March 2010 10:35

You can make it fit.

I would raise the Geckos or the PMDX off the plate on top of each other.

Most raise the Geckos, but I think raising the BOB may be better since this is a Trouble Shooting Point while building the control box. And the Geckos are very stable.

Mike

Regnar Fri 05 March 2010 12:18

3 Attachment(s)
Thanks guys you got the creative juices going. What I think I will do is mount the PMDX board on its side. I have nice chunk of Aluminum C Channel at work in the recycle bin. I will mill off one of the sides and Mount the board to the channel and mount the channel to the plate. That should free up a lot of room.

I was looking at my fan and admiring it when a thought came to my head. Is there going to be enough room behind the box to supply enough air flow. I only have about 3/8" clearance. So I plugged in the fan and moved it 3/8" from a solid surface and well it doesnt sound pretty. So I moved it 3/4" and then moved it 1" from the solids surface. It sounded great and dramatically improved the air flow.

I am milling some standoffs for the Din rails as we speak and might try and make gecko standoffs later tonight.

Regnar Sat 06 March 2010 18:06

I didnt get to work on the control box but did get to do another type of wiring. My wife has been bugging me for months to finish up the HTPC install in the closet and well it had to be done. Basically we installed our flat screen tv on the wall and all the gear is in a closet. A lot of wiring through the wall and to each component.

On another note I was finally able to get around to filming the test of the Gorilla glue. I would have to say I recommend it as long as you prep the surface with 60 grit sand paper. I scratched the hell out of the metal with a dotco. I would also suggest a lot of clamps while the glue is setting up. I was able to push, pull and hang off the piece. A shock from a dead blow hammer was able to remove the piece though. You will be able to see the video as soon as Youtube clears it.

Regnar Sat 06 March 2010 18:37

Here is the Video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgpR-SaWgZs

sailfl Sun 07 March 2010 00:45

Russell,

Great test and thanks for taking the time to try it. Gorilla glue is a lot cheaper than the 3M tape.

Robert M Mon 08 March 2010 04:40

A work of caution is needed in my opinion.
As Russell was pointing, surface prep is the main key to this Gorilla glue to adhere.
But also, other thing this glue (and most other ”non-gap filling” glues too) hate is GAPS.
As tiny as it can be, any gap will diminish the glue strength, to a point of useless !
Bear in mind his test was with two smooth steel surfaces !
Our application with crud steel angle Iron is just not smooth.
I, personally, tried it, with lots of efforts to make it work and "smoothing" the angle Iron w/xtra care cleaning both surfaces…, just nada… practically no gluing strength :mad:
At the end, testing gave me experience, knowledge of gluing steel with this …nop!!!
Ended up buying the 3M tape :o

No offence Russell, but put this tape in a fare compression with your test ( on this same prepped surface or even some rough ones, with the same “gluing / taping surface to compare with THAT , the tape will outperform that glue anytime !)

Conclusion….cause of the time it ended up costing me, ID advise to “stick” with what we know works with less time lost ( as time is $$$) !
To each his own…..my side & experience of it ( tried dam hard too ) !
Hope this help other with some thought :confused:

Amicalement, Robert ;)

Regnar Sun 21 March 2010 19:13

Control Box taking more shape!
 
7 Attachment(s)
Well after 2 weeks of hell at work I finally have some time off. I made all the standoffs and was having a really hard time figuring out where to place everything. So I started to re-think my situation and decided to go modular. I ended up using some 80/20 10 series to lift everything up and be able to move the rails and geckos around. You will also see that I used it to mount the breakout board sides ways. I have probably moved everything around maybe 10 times now and I am pretty happy on the way it is turning out.

I have to wait for a 12v power supply to arrive and I need to read a few things before going forward.

My power supply has a 5v 1 amp regulated and 2 amp unregulated connection. I guess I dont understand if it is a regulated power supply or not. I want to use this connection to power the breakout board but not sure if it is good or not for it. Manual is here if you guys could help me out. http://kelinginc.net/KL-5020.pdf

Some things that I need to read up on are the Disable connections on the geckos. How to wire the relay for the start stop/e-stop.

I think I have written this before but for other BUY A BIGGER CONTROL BOX THAN THE ONE I HAVE PURCHASED!

It will make your life a lot easier. Things are turning out great but the more and more I shove into it the harder and harder things get to position and route.

I am open to all comments on the box so if you see something that looks wrong please voice it here so I dont have things go up in a puff of smoke. :D

KenC Sun 21 March 2010 23:46

Nice work on the panel, looks compact!
Yes, you can never have a box that is large enough ;)

sailfl Mon 22 March 2010 02:47

Russell,

The box is small but you are doing an excellent job of laying out the parts and creatively making use of the space that you have. The layout is looking good.

Richards Mon 22 March 2010 15:35

Great job, but there's not much room below the PMDX-122 card to attach the parallel cable. Are you going to use the secondary connector instead?

smreish Mon 22 March 2010 18:01

Mike,
Good question. I just assumed that the top pin connector with a ribbon cable was going to be used. Hmmm, got me watching now.

cab. guy Mon 22 March 2010 19:28

Russell,
Last time I saw wiring job like that was in the engine compartment on a yacht.
Beautiful job,congrats.

Regnar Mon 22 March 2010 19:37

Thanks for the comments guys!

Richard and Sean you are both right I will be going with the secondary/ top db26. I do have a inch between the Centronics and the back plate. I could probably use one of these to make it work but I dont feel I need to at this time. http://www.computercablestore.com/Ce...R_PID1365.aspx

I think I will have to pick up some LAN cable to run the signals from the breakout board to the Geckos. The wire I have running to it now is just to bulky and take up a lot of room and doesnt want to make sharp turns. Its a good thing I bought 350' of it so no real skin off my back. I was also able to run the SSR wire and Limit Switch wires to the BOB today. Not real exciting but planning 10 steps ahead is required. I will need to wait until the 12v Power Supply arrives so I can run the wires for it. My goal is to finish the control box by this weekend. :rolleyes:

KenC Mon 22 March 2010 22:17

Russel, I use ribbon cables between my BOB & the Drivers, excellent space saver, extremely flexible. lay it close to a grounded chassis & you have a shielded cable made.

Regnar Fri 02 April 2010 17:15

Well just a update on the control box. I have almost everything wired. Between waiting for parts in the mail and working insane hours lately I haven't been able to give the electrics the attention that they require. I was able to get the standoffs welded on so the fan can move air around. Wired all the 220v section and almost everything to the BOB. I labeled some wires and drilled and tapped a lot of grounding points. What I have left is the door buttons and all the holes for the wires that go to the machine. I am just waiting on a 12v power supply all the water tight connectors for going through the box and they should be here Monday. I still need to find a db26 connector to plug in the BOB. If you guys know of a source for this it would be great if you could share. I can only find it in groups of 10 and I only need 1. I am starting to get anxious to build the beast. It looks like I will take 2 weeks off in the end of May so hopefully I can start building the table then.

cncb Tue 06 April 2010 20:38

Looks great, nice work! For a minute I thought you had your 4 cables going from the PMDX out of the enclosure or through a gland plate, I think you were just laying them out long over the edge rather than to the geckos? :)

Regnar Wed 07 April 2010 18:58

Brian your are right. I just needed them out of the way and that was the easiest. Now they are mounted over the middle of the geckos on standoffs and routed into the appropriate controller. I would take a photo but I am quickly running out of photo space so I will post one when I am complete with it. I just have the door switch to wire and for some reason it is kicking my A$$.

swatkins Wed 07 April 2010 21:43

Russell what are you using for your 12 volt supply? And how about a short description of all the components on the bottom DIN rail :)

Regnar Thu 08 April 2010 07:41

Steve
I am using Micron 12volt din mountable power supply
http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.55546/.f

I have two 16 amp circuit breakers and one 1amp circuit breaker. I have 30 amps going into the box and didnt want 30 amps going to the table.
http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.5663/.f

http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.5673/.f

For the limit/proximity switches I am using these be sure to get the 12v version for some reason this one keeps saying 24v. Also pick up a set of jumpers it saves on some wiring.

http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.5416/.f

The load break. You will need the switch and shaft.
http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.4511/.f

http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.4517/.f

http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.4843/.f

This is contactor
http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.99/.f

Last but not least the Solid State Relay for the Router. I cannot find it on their website but I have the SSR225. Here is the spec sheet.
http://factorymation.info/relays/SSR-DIN.pdf

Hope that helps Steve. I think I am on my 4th order to Factory Mation and need to order a few more things. :D

swatkins Thu 08 April 2010 20:45

That is a great help!

I see you are using the DIN mounted relays for the proxies and mounting them in your control box... The thread I have been reading is using relays mounted on the machine and routing just the one signal wire back to the bob using the 7 core wire... How are you running those proxy wires back to your panel?

Regnar Fri 09 April 2010 06:48

Steve, I cant say I am a expert on this and from the thread and from seeing Nils in action I will be running four 4 core wires to the relays and proxies. I could see a 7 core wire working just I havent seen it done yet and I dont like wondering off the path to much.

I forgot to mention you can buy the Din rails in single quantitys if you dont want 5 of them.
http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it...category=14881

Regnar Fri 09 April 2010 17:29

Ok I give, I need help!

Well first I am proud of myself for not lighting anything on fire and for not electrocuting myself. But here is the problem. I cannot get power past the contactor. I have it wired just like the diagram in the instructions for 230v.

I turn the disconnect on and nothing happens which is what I expect to happen.

Then I Push the green button power button on the outside door and the light illuminates and as soon as I release the button the light goes out. Not what I expected.

I have checked and rechecked with a meter and against the diagram and everything is good.

So I started to experiment a little. I pushed on the center area to make the contact and with power not going to the estop buttons nothing happens. With the power on and pushing down I have a horrible sounding humming/buzzing noise.

I have not seen if power comes out the other end but I dont really want try just incase things dont go good.

So I need suggestions on what to try and what to look for. I could get you guys a video or some pictures but I dont know if it would help out that much as their is nothing much happening. Thanks for the help.

Robert M Fri 09 April 2010 17:51

Russell, I’ll jump at it first !!:eek:

First off, yes, photos of you controller/electrical box or better yet, also include your actual electrical diagram if you made one aside of the plans ?

2nd, give me some voltage reading at a few points with a millimeter, if you have one. If not, will still manage :cool:
If no multi meter, maybe a minimum of a test light that can take +/- 220-240Vac.
Check where some & where no voltage and come back with some info & photos, I’ll be around later !
See ya, Robert ;)

swatkins Fri 09 April 2010 20:09

Try testing the voltage going to the control on the contactor. The sound you are hearing could be the contactor not "latching up"

cab. guy Fri 09 April 2010 20:29

Russel,
check the coil voltage at A1 A2 In both senerios---Power on and no green btn.
Power on green btn. manually held.I agree it sounds like your relay is missing proper
feed to latch.


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