Cutting Some Signs! #95 - Mystic, CT
 

Here the basics and of my machine and a few pictures of my control panel I have thus far.
Will post some of machine shortly.
Started on 4/09
PK296A2A-SG7.2 motor on order
Half coil
PMDX 122 should have gone to 126 for more inputs, will have to double some
203v controllers
AC tech VDF 5hp
Mech 3 programming Attachment 13032

Attachment 13033
ELO monitor
IBM computer
Power supply 40V
RLP-104 relay 12 volt
AM1-AN-4H sensors
Undecided on spindle and program to produce drawings yet
Looking for suggestions

Thanks

Al

Attachment 13037

Attachment 13038

Attachment 13039

Attachment 13040

Hi Al

Thanks for sharing some photos of your machine.
You may have taken a while but everything you have done seems to be very thorough indeed.
I am still marvelling at the size of the capacitor you have used for the power supply.
It looks like the machine might run for 10 mins after dropping the power off. :D

Don't sweat the small stuff too much and punch on to get a running machine, perfection can always come later.
Initially the PMDX 122 break out board should do you fine but the newer PMDX 126 does have some nice features esp. when wiring the proximity switches.

Regards
Ross

Hi all.

Now have control panel hooked up table secured and emblems on. It took a little time to figure out the program. That is to make everything work properly. It now homes properly. I think, at least it says all zeros when it is done. Still not sure about OEM codes. I put in one something and I run and the codes seem to be something different. I quess it has a mind of it's own, BUT IT CUTS AIR SMOTHLY.

This week I i have to decide on a spindle leaning towards a 5 hp colombo, boy what a difference in price from the chinese spindles. Are they really worth the difference?

Does anyone have a resiterable copy of "Aspire with Vcarve" they would like to sell?

I would like to thank all for the help on this site. It's been fun and with all your help and advise I will soon have a great finished machine.

Thanks all

Al

OEM Codes
 

Here are the codes for Feedhold and Resume.

Attachment 13068

Regards
Ross

Hi Ross,

I am using those external buttons and they work fine. But, where are the jog codes shown on your screen come from. My machine seem to change what put in but in codes for Z-- Z++ and so no change to different numbers than what I enter.The machine stop on the broken signal and it does zero the x & y property, don't have the z hooked up yet. I just how the codes create themselves maby i shouldn't care it works, just would like to know.

Al

The jog codes come over on the default install of Mach3 and do not need to be manually entered.
Hope this is a sufficient explanation, it sure is an easy one:D.

Ross

l guess less knowing is better at this stage, thanks.

Al

Al, what size main beams are you using? They look a little taller than stock.

they are the standard 8"

al

I think the last photo is compressed in the x direction?

Pic is distorted, check out the oval blade on the Porter Cable Chop Saw (sitting on top of a vintage Work Mate - also designed by a South African ;) )

Not sure how to properly size images. Some day? I am learning.

Does anyone have a design for a colombo spindle?

Leaning to an RS 90 CPE 25.

al

I purchased my spindle, drive and pre-wired cable bundle from Blurry customs. They are a forum member and have pretty great customer service.

What kind of mounting bracket/plate is required to mount the RS 90 spindle.

Does some one have a good design ?

Al

Al,
I used the interface plate shown in the drawing. The end of the z-slide is designed to be modular. I personally made a 8" x 4" x 3/8" alum plate that had the proper tapped holes, countersunk holes and hardened roll pins to register to the z-slide. I going to see if I can find a picture to post from my build documents.
The Columbo and HSD have tapped holes, so the interface plate was required to properly mount.

Sean

sounds easy . picture would be nice

Thanks

Al

That is how i have my z-slide drilled.

Sounds like I just need a 3/8" flat plate to so the spindle will clear the v rollers. One bolt is enough to secure the mount to the z- slide with the two pins. Than, four bolts will secure the spindle to the flat plate.

sounds good thanks

al

Yes,
You have it correct. 4 countersunk bolts to mount plate to spindle. The 3/8" plate is either tapped and you thread through the z-slide to it. I personally tapped and countersunk the 3/8" plate and used a fully threaded bolt to act like a stud. I threaded the bolt into the plate, set with threadlocker, then mounted the spindle over the now threaded bolt. (it is then covered up by the spindle). I used a single, NYLOC on the draw bolt for the backer nut.

Did that make sense? LOL

very much so

thanks

Hi Sean,

I have ordered my spindle from Blurry customs. RS90.

In the lay out of mounting plate, if I keep the 3/8" plate even with the bottom of the z slide and drill the holes near the top that will put the bottom of the collet nut about 8" off the table. The z slide is now10". Does that sound rite or should it be higher?

Al

Attachment 13076

It's hard to see, but I put my mounting plate about flush.
8" is about right.

Here some close up pictures of several things that might be of interest.

Mounting plate for RS90 spindle. I just cut a slot in the head of the bolt and added a piece of metal ( piece of an allen wrench )to lock the bolt from turning, the epoxied it in.

My z-stop sensor, this senses the gas shock and is easy to remove and adjust. This location shouldn’t interfere with the spindle or the dust collection system, I hope>>>>

The transition from the e-chain to the conduit to my control panel.
Attachment 13086

Attachment 13087

Attachment 13088

Attachment 13089
These two simple bends could for the z-slide and the e-chain could be helpful if added to the bend parts list.

Al

Alan,
That looks like a nice spindle adapter plate.
I like your positive "stud" draw bolt. The epoxy should work well.

Well, I received spindle and installed it, Programmed my VFD all went fine. Started to warm up spindle, ran fine then went into reset. Sometimes five minutes sometimes two, sometimes ten. Read on>>>> then found a section on de-bouncing. Set it to 1000 ran fine. What should the de-bounce bounce setting be?

Still trying to cut air.

Getting like chatter from the slave on x-axes almost like it is stopping and being dragged along. But, only sometimes. Seems to home 2 axes fine properly. Enough for one day>>> read on tomorrow and play on some more tomorrow.

Hope to be cutting this weekend.

Al

De-bounce settings are a mystery for the most part.
With that blurry customs set up you have (which is like machine #28 for me) the de-bounce was incremented by 100's until the e-stop/stop flutter was stable. I just checked my old Mach 3 xml file and I have it set at 1200.

That slave axis dragging could be interference from the spindle causing step/direction inputs to get conflicting signal. Make sure all your spindle related wiring is well away from the geckos.

Is your VFD being controlled via contact closure from MACH or via rs-232?

Sean

Hi Sean,

I tried the de-bounce at 100 and all went away and ran fine, Then i read in the trouble shooting section to set it at 1000 so i did. still ran fine. Is there any benifit to lower the value for our application?

The a motor did this once and a wile usually during joging long distances. It hasn't done it at all during the trial cuts of air.

Al

No real difference except if the signal noise was interfering with the estop/stop circuit, then you may have to push-and-hold the stop button longer for an initiation of the stop. This should have no affect on the e-stop because those buttons are held contact when pushed, not momentary. The de-bounce number is changing how often MACH samples the line for a signal. Before de-bounce, you looked at it every sample - now it's looking for a hard signal every 100 signals, or whatever the setting is.

Does that help?

Hi Sean,

Yes it did.

In Mech 3 “general config setup” I turned on “set slave with master axis” the dragging seems to have gone away.

On that screen there is a field charge pump on in e stop. Should that be on?

Spindle now stays on at rest. When cutting woodpecker in air the spindle did out and the program kept right on moving as if it was cutting. I will play with de-bounce some more and keep on trying things.

Al

A little more experimenting. I start by turning on the spindle with the vfd, I execute a program it hits a command line with a "M3" and the spindle shuts down and the program continues.

Lost again.

al

M3/M5 codes are On/Off for spindle. Try leaving the spindle off and see if it comes on when you get the first M3 code (spindle ON)

cannot do that since i am using the relay on the pmdx-122 to turn on the vdf, I can rewire this so the load contactor stays on and the relay only starts the spindle within the vdf. Then have the e-stop turn off the contactor and the bob to start and stop the spindle. If you think that will be better.

Thanks

Al

I do not own a spindle (yet), so my contactor is wired so the BOB (G540) turns the router on with a M3 code and off with a M5 code (setup in Mach3). Without a VFD & spindle of my own I'm out of my element.

What are the connections from your PMDX-122 to the VFD? Contact closure only? Or speed control as well? What is your VFD programmed to do on contact closure? Start up or shut down?

If you're only doing contact closure, then it sounds to be like you either need to invert the pin value, or adjust the VFD programming, because you are getting a stop instead of a start.

Hi Brad,

PMDX-122 - J7 - no- contact closes and pulls in contactor coil, contactor energizes the VDF. That is all I have at this time. I start the spindle from the VFD.

One step at a time. lot to learn I will play later.
I could go in and edit the code and take out the M3 command, but would like to make it run properly.

I am willing to rewire the contactor coil into e-stop and tie the relay on the PMDX so it will be only act a reset if that is the correct way to go.

I would like it correct.

The main question is. Should the VDF contactor keep the vdf live.Then for a reset/stop stop the spindle and a true e-stop drop contactor from suppling the VFD.

If the VFD is de-enedgized, I believe, also lose the ramp down / breaking of the spindle. Not safe.

thanks

AL

edited out the M3 code all ran fine.

now to correct the problem.

al

Generally, you do not want to turn the power supply to the VFD on and off. In fact, I bet your VFD manual says not to place a contactor between the VFD and the breaker.
And never place one between the VFD and motor.

Imagine that the spindle is running at full speed. Now pull the power. Inertia keeps the spindle spinning, and it's now a generator pushing power back at the VFD. However, the VFD doesn't have any control power anymore, so it can't do anything about it.

If the spindle is running at full speed and you tell the VFD to stop, it shunts the power coming from the spindle into a braking resistor (internal for small VFDs; an external device for large ones), and it can bring the bit to a stop much faster than just freewheeling down. It also prevents any power transients and spikes that arise from breaking open a contactor under load.

So the VFD should be on all the time that the machine is on. You should use the relay to provide contact closure to the VFD as a start/stop signal.

If you want speed control, we can discuss a simple circuit to do that.

I will change that tomorrow. Yes, I would like programing and / or Mech3 to turn on and off and speed would be nice. I do appriciate all the help and hpoe I can help others in in the learning process.

Thanks,

al